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Моделируем "meta experience" (1) Онтология "meta experience"
metanymous wrote in metapractice

What is the Experience of “Meta”?

Posted by: Steve Andreas in: Articles

What is the Experience of “Meta”?
A dialogue between Steve Andreas and Michael Hall

Some time ago, I (Steve) made the following general proposal to Michael for a dialogue to exemplify a respectful exchange of views in the field:

In the past, you and I have had significantly different fundamental understandings on a number of issues that could be the basis for a public dialogue between us, such as:

1. Whether or not it is important to distinguish between two uses of “meta” to refer to large scope (“the big picture”) or general category — a topic I explored at length in my Six Blind Elephants books.

2. My description of your concept of “layering” as the reverse of nested categories in the logical levels of naïve set theory, as set forth in Elephants, pp. 114-116

3. Whether Submodalities are meta or subdivisions of scopes of experience.

Of course you may have changed your views on one or more of these issues, or you might prefer to choose others. Assuming we could agree on an interesting issue on which we have differing views, I have some fairly specific ideas about how to create a respectful dialogue to avoid misunderstandings, side issues, etc.

Privately one of us would write up a position statement on the selected issue, and the other would respond to it in writing. Then we would each edit or revise our positions until we are both satisfied that we have had an opportunity to present our position fully, respond fully to the other’s position, and that we each understand the other clearly, to avoid problems like, “Well, that’s not what I said,” or “That’s what I said, but what I really meant was—” etc. This would also be an opportunity for each of us to notice any “ad hominem” arguments or other logical fallacies, and remove them.

After we are both satisfied with the result of this process, we would jointly offer this to the public (the summit group, your and my blogs) and invite comments from others.

I think this could serve as an example of working toward clarification or resolution of important issues that currently divide or confuse the field. Please let me know if you might be interested in joining with me on this, and/or if you have other views on how we could better accomplish the goal of presenting contrasting views in a way that could provide a productive dialogue.

Michael agreed in principle, and sent me a number of different extensive position statements on the meaning of “Meta,” and I take this as an invitation to focus on this topic. I prefer to begin with a more concise statement for our dialogue, but other writing projects (and my struggle with greatly diminished energy due to Parkinson’s disease) have delayed me until now. ... http://realpeoplepress.com/blog/what-is-the-experience-of-meta?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+SteveAndreasNlpBlog+%28Steve+Andreas%27+NLP+Blog%29

Мета опыт


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Start with the present moment, or a moment from some time in the past, and notice your response to this very short segment of time. . . .

Now make a very short movie by adding a few seconds that occurred before that moment, and adding a few seconds that follow that moment (real or imagined), and notice any change in your response. . . .

Now make that short movie a little longer, by adding a few minutes that occurred before that moment, and adding a few minutes that follow that moment (real or imagined), and notice any change in your response. . . .

Now make that movie even longer by adding the half-hour that occurred before that moment, and adding the half-hour that follow that moment (real or imagined), and notice any change in your response. . . .

Continue to gradually lengthen this movie, stepwise, pausing each time to notice your response, . . .by adding days, weeks, months, years, decades, centuries, millennia, until your movie is as long as the age of the universe before and after this moment. . . .

In this experiment, the scope of time attended to is gradually increased. You could also start with a large scope of time, and then gradually diminish the length of the movie, or you could “change frame” by attending to a completely different scope of time that doesn’t overlap at all.

When you change the scope of what you observe, that usually changes the content of what is attended to, and that often changes your response to the scope of what you see. Your experience of a longer scope of time will tend to be less detailed than a shorter one. However, all of these different scopes will be more or less sensory-based images of what you see.

The same kind of experiment can be easily done in the auditory or kinesthetic modality, but only with some difficulty with taste and smell, because of our limitations in those modalities.


Итак, предложено представить: «Момент из прошлого/ настоящего -> + момент из прошлого/ настоящего несколько секунд до и после -> + несколько минут -> + полчаса -> + дни, недели, месяцы, годы, десятилетия, столетия, тысячелетия, миллионо- миллиардолетия…»

Всё это «представление»/ фильм есть опыт воображения. Само по себе воображение есть сорт «вырожденного» мета, которое уже не идёт в зачёт в таком качестве, ибо активность воображение есть значительная часть ментальной продукции современного человека.

И тем не менее, с «увеличением масштаба» представления времени или с его радикальным изменением, мы имеем всем известные методики прямо из НЛП1;2, которые представляют развитый мета опыт:

(1) Это аптайм, в котором «времени» просто нет. Нет ни прошлого, ни будущего, ни, в каком-то смысле, настоящего. Или можно определить так, – в аптайме всё «содержание» времени сублимировано в текущие действия оператора. И, если оператор выберет бездеятельность в аптайме, тогда некое «действие» будет совершать бесконечное «движение» в окружающем:

Uptime (19) Резюмирование некоторых обсуждений и личного опыта

(2) Это Сущностное Ощущение, сопровождающее/ итожащее Сущностную Трансформацию. В отличие от аптайма, сущностное ощущение вбирает в себя всё «содержание» прошлого, настоящего и будущего. При этом, сущностное ощущение является одновременно:

--интуитивным знанием «всего»
--рациональным знанием/ осознанием «всего»
--референцией/ истинностью указанного «всего» знания

Моделируем Сущностную Трансформацию (7) сортировка частей

Edited at 2018-01-15 03:36 pm (UTC)

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